La Ventana Kite Expo Race issues and suggestions
- gnukid
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We have come a long way toward legitimizing Kite Racing, it was a short time ago when we sailed across the start line shadowing yacht races to demonstrate to the crowd of onlookers that Kites can sail upwind and complete the course. The RC fired a shot-gun 5 times shouting "clear the course". We stood our ground as we were in no way endangering the yachts to windward and had every right to sail among yachts safely to leeward. I shouted back to them, "communicate your safety concern" to which they could not reply. Afterwards the RC director apologized to us and said that we proved we could be in control and at no point had there in fact been any safety concern.Shortly thereafter Kites were invited to compete with windsurfers and skiffs in the annual Ronstan Bridge to Bridge Race. That moment forward we achieved acceptance by the traditional yachting community which has embraced us as visionaries in an evolution of yachting. We have successfully re-enforced the concept that kites are yachts and that our boats follow the same rules as all yachts, yet our sails are extended equipment pieces of our vessels.
Yes, we have achieved two National Championships with recognition that the races were fair and according to Yacht Racing rules. We are on the verge of an accredited Kite Racing World Championship thanks to everyone's efforts and perhaps in the future an Olympic demonstration. At the same time, we lost ground in the windsurfing arena with the threat of loss of Olympic Windsurfing. As you may recall the recent Olympic Trials were marred by controversy, the winner of the Women's division was replaced by another sailor after the event in a fantastic decision which precipitated months of hearings toward resolution. In the Men's division the winner found himself the target of 7 protests, I recall, each of which he defended. So, it is not without concern for the manipulations of results that I speak.
I made some simple points about last year's event in La Ventana because few seem to be aware as the RC failed to communicate these issues. That is, the majority of people had no idea that the 1st and 2nd place winners were thrown out for a rule stated privately to only those two (finally admitted here by both Tim and Marnia) which punished them for their action of sailing to the start line prior to the start. My objection is to this use of private rules and communication to manipulate the results. Of the two racers who received this private communication over the sounds of a party, one is deaf and the other not an experienced racer. So it is understandable that they did not understand the implications of Tim's private comment.
More so, it became apparent that after Tim rushed to the winners to DSQ them, the RC failed to score many of the following racers. So, the results were not recorded. Few people were aware because it wasn't communicated. As you can see here both Tim and Marina, who I do not know, they sort of acknowledge this but not directly and instead say it was a huge success. We raised a lot of money!
So, it seems that few people are aware of the truth, that the results were not accurate yet Tim choose the winner and DSQed the real winners, the actual winner was a partially deaf senior who achieved the greatest win of his lifetime. Tim at no point mentioned this in the awards, by omission of facts the results were not based on the actual results.
So, when Tim calls for a Charity and a Race, and few know the facts behind the event results, it leaves me a bit suspicious of the results of the whole event and the charity fund. There is not only a failure to account for the Race Results but also an accounting of the money received and disbursed. If we know that the result was not as it seems in Racing, we need to be more vigilant in evaluating the event organization as a whole.
Why do I care? Well I mentioned the history of windsurfing, the results of the 1984 manipulation of some races at Windsurfing Championship in the Gorge, the manipulation of results of the Baja International Championships and the recent manipulations of the Windsurfing Trials, each of which saw tampering by the RC in the result which negatively affected the sport's perceived fairness and precipitated a loss of interest.
It is with desire for success, for increased recognition and for the good of La Ventana and El Sargento I speak. I was asked by residents of the region to speak since some people do not speak english effectively enough to voice their concerns here. I am able to and am qualified to speak out and apparently I am one of very few who paid enough attention to the results to see that there wasn't an accurate result nor disclosure.
I support the event, I support the racers and volunteers, I support the cities of La Ventana and El Sargento and am pleased to have the largest event in our sport come to our city in the tradition we began more than 20 years ago.
I ask that the organizers speak the truth, report the circumstances accurately and admit mistakes. It is totally fine to make a mistake, for everything to go wrong is acceptable but to fail to admit it is a serious misrepresentation.
It's simple, the race got bigger than expected and we need organizers that have the background in Yacht Racing to serve as RC Director and organizers. The Charity also needs to be managed in a transparent manner which increases confidence.
I am sorry to be the one to sound the alarm. I would not had the organizers been more forthright in communicating these issues.
Yes, we have achieved two National Championships with recognition that the races were fair and according to Yacht Racing rules. We are on the verge of an accredited Kite Racing World Championship thanks to everyone's efforts and perhaps in the future an Olympic demonstration. At the same time, we lost ground in the windsurfing arena with the threat of loss of Olympic Windsurfing. As you may recall the recent Olympic Trials were marred by controversy, the winner of the Women's division was replaced by another sailor after the event in a fantastic decision which precipitated months of hearings toward resolution. In the Men's division the winner found himself the target of 7 protests, I recall, each of which he defended. So, it is not without concern for the manipulations of results that I speak.
I made some simple points about last year's event in La Ventana because few seem to be aware as the RC failed to communicate these issues. That is, the majority of people had no idea that the 1st and 2nd place winners were thrown out for a rule stated privately to only those two (finally admitted here by both Tim and Marnia) which punished them for their action of sailing to the start line prior to the start. My objection is to this use of private rules and communication to manipulate the results. Of the two racers who received this private communication over the sounds of a party, one is deaf and the other not an experienced racer. So it is understandable that they did not understand the implications of Tim's private comment.
More so, it became apparent that after Tim rushed to the winners to DSQ them, the RC failed to score many of the following racers. So, the results were not recorded. Few people were aware because it wasn't communicated. As you can see here both Tim and Marina, who I do not know, they sort of acknowledge this but not directly and instead say it was a huge success. We raised a lot of money!
So, it seems that few people are aware of the truth, that the results were not accurate yet Tim choose the winner and DSQed the real winners, the actual winner was a partially deaf senior who achieved the greatest win of his lifetime. Tim at no point mentioned this in the awards, by omission of facts the results were not based on the actual results.
So, when Tim calls for a Charity and a Race, and few know the facts behind the event results, it leaves me a bit suspicious of the results of the whole event and the charity fund. There is not only a failure to account for the Race Results but also an accounting of the money received and disbursed. If we know that the result was not as it seems in Racing, we need to be more vigilant in evaluating the event organization as a whole.
Why do I care? Well I mentioned the history of windsurfing, the results of the 1984 manipulation of some races at Windsurfing Championship in the Gorge, the manipulation of results of the Baja International Championships and the recent manipulations of the Windsurfing Trials, each of which saw tampering by the RC in the result which negatively affected the sport's perceived fairness and precipitated a loss of interest.
It is with desire for success, for increased recognition and for the good of La Ventana and El Sargento I speak. I was asked by residents of the region to speak since some people do not speak english effectively enough to voice their concerns here. I am able to and am qualified to speak out and apparently I am one of very few who paid enough attention to the results to see that there wasn't an accurate result nor disclosure.
I support the event, I support the racers and volunteers, I support the cities of La Ventana and El Sargento and am pleased to have the largest event in our sport come to our city in the tradition we began more than 20 years ago.
I ask that the organizers speak the truth, report the circumstances accurately and admit mistakes. It is totally fine to make a mistake, for everything to go wrong is acceptable but to fail to admit it is a serious misrepresentation.
It's simple, the race got bigger than expected and we need organizers that have the background in Yacht Racing to serve as RC Director and organizers. The Charity also needs to be managed in a transparent manner which increases confidence.
I am sorry to be the one to sound the alarm. I would not had the organizers been more forthright in communicating these issues.
- thekiteboarderusa
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- Joined:Tue Feb 05, 2008 9:07 am
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Re: La Ventana Kite Expo Race issues and suggestions
Guys,
Like LMG stated, we are trying to run a fun and safe event. This is not a pre-qualifier for a world cup, nationals, trials or international ranking. We welcome constructive critisism but if you want a "serious" event with a point system, fully equipped support fleet, rigid rules and regulations (nothing wrong with this!), compete in the US Nationals or PKRA.
RE: organizational background, Tim raced sailboats for 6 years (FJ's, Lasers, and Keelboats ) and was also a sailing and racing instructor for kids camps for 8 summers so he's not exactly green. I think a lot of you respect Steve Gunn and he may be helping out. I will also note that Steve fully supported Tim's decision to disqualify the racers. I will say that in hindsight, you are right Paul. it would've been good to recognize the rider in question who won even though he was disqualified and give him an honorable mention/award.
Paul, please come introduce yourself to me at the event. I'll be the asian girl in the registration tent running around with her hair on fire:-)
Like LMG stated, we are trying to run a fun and safe event. This is not a pre-qualifier for a world cup, nationals, trials or international ranking. We welcome constructive critisism but if you want a "serious" event with a point system, fully equipped support fleet, rigid rules and regulations (nothing wrong with this!), compete in the US Nationals or PKRA.
RE: organizational background, Tim raced sailboats for 6 years (FJ's, Lasers, and Keelboats ) and was also a sailing and racing instructor for kids camps for 8 summers so he's not exactly green. I think a lot of you respect Steve Gunn and he may be helping out. I will also note that Steve fully supported Tim's decision to disqualify the racers. I will say that in hindsight, you are right Paul. it would've been good to recognize the rider in question who won even though he was disqualified and give him an honorable mention/award.
Paul, please come introduce yourself to me at the event. I'll be the asian girl in the registration tent running around with her hair on fire:-)
- stringy
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Re: La Ventana Kite Expo Race issues and suggestions
i did the race last year. Actually did both the double cross and the crossing. I had a great experience doing both. I met alot of cool people from the bay area and remain friends with them to this day. here's my input in regards to improvements that I noticed from my own personal experience. I was on the second wave of panga boats that shuttled riders over.
I was told we would be riding over and having a lunch on the island. when we arrived, all the food was gone.
If food is provided again, please make sure that there is adequate amount provided for all riders that are on the second panga delivery.
I registered on the day of the riders' meeting at palapas. because I signed up so late, coupled with the high demand of riders for the event, the organization ran out of rashies. those were very cool rashies. I would suggest making additional rashies, maybe without some numbers on the backside. that way if the turnout is low, they could be sold at the Expo to those who want one, but not neccessarily want to participate. just an idea. I know putting together an event, ordering the rashies, it all can be overwhelming.
Just so you know, the crossing was one of the funnest races I have ever experienced. It was alot like the gorge blowout, but less stress and more fun. I can't wait to participate this year. keep up the good work.
stringy
I was told we would be riding over and having a lunch on the island. when we arrived, all the food was gone.
If food is provided again, please make sure that there is adequate amount provided for all riders that are on the second panga delivery.
I registered on the day of the riders' meeting at palapas. because I signed up so late, coupled with the high demand of riders for the event, the organization ran out of rashies. those were very cool rashies. I would suggest making additional rashies, maybe without some numbers on the backside. that way if the turnout is low, they could be sold at the Expo to those who want one, but not neccessarily want to participate. just an idea. I know putting together an event, ordering the rashies, it all can be overwhelming.
Just so you know, the crossing was one of the funnest races I have ever experienced. It was alot like the gorge blowout, but less stress and more fun. I can't wait to participate this year. keep up the good work.
stringy
- thekiteboarderusa
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Re: La Ventana Kite Expo Race issues and suggestions
Rashies solved for next year. Competition is limited to 100 competition class and 50 sportsman. This year we did not want to turn anyone away so we ended up turning the event t's inside out and spray painting numbers on them for the last 10 or so entrants. lol. We also learned that we need numbers on both the front and back of jerseys!
RE: food, we will definitely keep a better handle on this. I think the food running out had something to do with the discovery of the first load of pangas;-) Don't expect a repeat performance of this but it did inspire us to do a treasure hunt while the racers wait for the bay to fill in. Grand Prize is a new 2009 Naish kite of your size and choice, sponsored by Sol Kiteboarding.
Note to all: Online registration is available so avoid the wait of signing up last minute at the skipper's meeting Wed night at palapas ventana restaurant, 7p. Early registration has been extended to $60 for one or all comps and includes lunch over at the island and event jersey. Register at http://www.palapasventana.com/news_deta ... x?NewsId=4
RE: food, we will definitely keep a better handle on this. I think the food running out had something to do with the discovery of the first load of pangas;-) Don't expect a repeat performance of this but it did inspire us to do a treasure hunt while the racers wait for the bay to fill in. Grand Prize is a new 2009 Naish kite of your size and choice, sponsored by Sol Kiteboarding.
Note to all: Online registration is available so avoid the wait of signing up last minute at the skipper's meeting Wed night at palapas ventana restaurant, 7p. Early registration has been extended to $60 for one or all comps and includes lunch over at the island and event jersey. Register at http://www.palapasventana.com/news_deta ... x?NewsId=4
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Re: La Ventana Kite Expo Race issues and suggestions
going to la ventana to go prep myself for this year...it's going to be awesome.
thanks to all of you putting this together, i've been looking forward to it since last year's expo.
thanks to all of you putting this together, i've been looking forward to it since last year's expo.
ella
bayareakitesurf.com
liftkiteboarding.com[/b]
bayareakitesurf.com
liftkiteboarding.com[/b]
- GracieMarie
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Re: La Ventana Kite Expo Race issues and suggestions
GNUKID: "Now, if Greg and Tron were training partners and they worked hard to compete, they traveled a long way having spent their hard earned money to race and they sailed the course correctly and fastest and won first place in their respective divisions, but then Tim threw them out because of a rule he decided upon but not posted prior to the race, and he failed to score the following finishers correctly I bet they would be irritated as well....
So, that fact that Tim and Tron are so outspoken in denial of the facts and say it was a huge success, to me is freaky....
This is outrageous. I am critical because its the right thing to do and if it helps achieve a better result you will each be thanking me for speaking up when you didn't."
Funny observation, Paul. LMG and I are racing partners, sort of....and if we worked hard to compete in, say, the 100m butterfly at the Olympics, and then decided that we were going to do the breaststroke instead, well....everyone would expect us to get DQ'd. Even though we might have had a really really good time doing it our way.
Tim and I are not in denial of the facts; we are not in agreement with your reality.
GNUKID: "It is with desire for success, for increased recognition and for the good of La Ventana and El Sargento I speak. I was asked by residents of the region to speak since some people do not speak english effectively enough to voice their concerns here."
SHUT up! Are you seriously saying that you were asked by "residents of the region to speak"? Name names, hombre. I live here. I find THAT claim even more astounding than your Staph propaganda.
"GNUKID": "...some people do not speak english effectively enough to voice their concerns here."?????? Oh my God, you're hurting me! My jaws are sore from laughing so hard! Some of the local Mexicans were so concerned about our little race that they drafted you to fight the good fight? Or was it one of the gringo locals with a poor command of the English language?
The local community got a $12k capital shot in the proverbial arm, i.e., structural improvement of the schools, etc. The community usually doesn't get a chunk of funding like that and then say, "Listen, Paul. We really want you to tear into those race organizers for the shoddy and unfair treatment of those DQ'd racers!"
Whew, that was hysterical Paul. Thanks for the entertainment. I'll still catch your kite. And to everyone else: Kiting was OUTSTANDING today. Ya'll are going to have SUCH an excellent time here in January. Cheers, T
So, that fact that Tim and Tron are so outspoken in denial of the facts and say it was a huge success, to me is freaky....
This is outrageous. I am critical because its the right thing to do and if it helps achieve a better result you will each be thanking me for speaking up when you didn't."
Funny observation, Paul. LMG and I are racing partners, sort of....and if we worked hard to compete in, say, the 100m butterfly at the Olympics, and then decided that we were going to do the breaststroke instead, well....everyone would expect us to get DQ'd. Even though we might have had a really really good time doing it our way.
Tim and I are not in denial of the facts; we are not in agreement with your reality.
GNUKID: "It is with desire for success, for increased recognition and for the good of La Ventana and El Sargento I speak. I was asked by residents of the region to speak since some people do not speak english effectively enough to voice their concerns here."
SHUT up! Are you seriously saying that you were asked by "residents of the region to speak"? Name names, hombre. I live here. I find THAT claim even more astounding than your Staph propaganda.
"GNUKID": "...some people do not speak english effectively enough to voice their concerns here."?????? Oh my God, you're hurting me! My jaws are sore from laughing so hard! Some of the local Mexicans were so concerned about our little race that they drafted you to fight the good fight? Or was it one of the gringo locals with a poor command of the English language?
The local community got a $12k capital shot in the proverbial arm, i.e., structural improvement of the schools, etc. The community usually doesn't get a chunk of funding like that and then say, "Listen, Paul. We really want you to tear into those race organizers for the shoddy and unfair treatment of those DQ'd racers!"
Whew, that was hysterical Paul. Thanks for the entertainment. I'll still catch your kite. And to everyone else: Kiting was OUTSTANDING today. Ya'll are going to have SUCH an excellent time here in January. Cheers, T
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Re: La Ventana Kite Expo Race issues and suggestions
little e wrote:
"going to la ventana to go prep myself for this year...it's going to be awesome.
thanks to all of you putting this together, i've been looking forward to it since last year's expo."
---SO REFRESHING.., I had to do it again!
Enjoy,
L.M.G.
"going to la ventana to go prep myself for this year...it's going to be awesome.
thanks to all of you putting this together, i've been looking forward to it since last year's expo."
---SO REFRESHING.., I had to do it again!
Enjoy,
L.M.G.
- kitenaked
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Re: La Ventana Kite Expo Race issues and suggestions
I need to see some of the training tapes between Tron and LMG. Kinda like Taibo or the Jane Fonda jazzercise kionda thinG?
FREAKY. That is so 80's..
SI Crew Rocks.
FREAKY. That is so 80's..
SI Crew Rocks.
Chris
Kite Naked
Benicia Kite and Paddle Sports
4562 East 2nd Street, Unit J & K
Benicia, CA 94510
209-304-2200
http://www.kitenaked.com
Slingshot
Kite Naked
Benicia Kite and Paddle Sports
4562 East 2nd Street, Unit J & K
Benicia, CA 94510
209-304-2200
http://www.kitenaked.com
Slingshot
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- Old School
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Re: La Ventana Kite Expo Race issues and suggestions
Tapes! OOh- "those" tapes will never be released..
L.M.G.
L.M.G.
- GracieMarie
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Re: La Ventana Kite Expo Race issues and suggestions
Spindoctor, training tapes are available for a nominal fee at http://www.righteousbreastroke.com. LMG is a certified breast realignment specialist.spindoctor wrote:I need to see some of the training tapes between Tron and LMG. Kinda like Taibo or the Jane Fonda jazzercise kionda thinG?
FREAKY. SI Crew Rocks.
Looking forward to having ya'll over to the party during the event, where we will INSIST on having a good time.
Freakily Yours, GM 8)
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