localism gone too far?

[JimmyJack]

I have tried to surf Pacifica several times and even as a kid, Rockaway as I mention, but it's a bit closed out. I did kite Pacifica on Christmas eve this last year in a solid onshore gale that brought hail. It was fun as an experience, but not something I would do everyday...or maybe ever again.

[friggin old guy]

I can explain the Lunada Bay thing to you. I grew up there, surfing the spot in the 70's. I knew the "Bay Boys" and was tolerated by them, because I was a decent surfer, was a local and knew how to mind my manners in the lineup. I always thought most of them were flaming hypocrites and jerks, since they thought nothing of surfing elsewhere but vibed people that came up to surf the Bay. I even got vibed when I went back to visit my mother, who still lives there, even though the crop of Bay Boys that were there at the time knew I was a returning local.

My take on it: unfortunately, surfing seems to attract a disproportionate amount of sociopaths compared to the general population. And unfortunately, the thing about localism is that.....it works. As evidenced in the forum answers here, if you're looking to have a good time, the last thing you want to do is deal with some jerk who seems to be more intent on getting in peoples' faces than just having a good time himself. Combine the effectiveness of localism with a population of people that have little conscience about exhibiting antisocial behavior....it becomes a viscous cycle that has built in Lunada Bay over the years, and has unfortunately (or fortunately if you have antisocial tendencies and like uncrowded waves) kept the spot relatively uncrowded compared to how good that wave is, smack dab in the middle of a major urban zone.

Another thing that feeds the localism thing is the code of behavior necessary to get along in a surfing lineup. It's competitive, but there are rules. Break the rules and you're going to get at minimum harsh language. Boiling it down to it's basics, the primary rule is: thou shalt not get in other people's way when they're on a wave. Everything else is an offshoot. Since you have priority if you're the closest to the peak, the competition to get into the right spot without being impolite or pushy is intense, and there's a learning curve in figuring that all out. It's intimidating to the uninitiated. Add some loudmouth jerk to them mix and it's just not any fun.

There will always be some overlap of surfing mores (or lack of them) into the kitesurfing community, and most especially at wave sailing spots. One of these, often confused with pure localism, is the idea that if you have a secret spot that is not well known to the general public, you should not blabber the location of said spot to others. If said spot is introduced to you by folks that know it, and if you publicize said spot.....that is taking the secret out of the secret, and is generally regarded as kind of uncool. That's pretty much human nature, I think, and not sociopathic behavior. Vibing or intimidating somebody that shows up to "your" spot....well, that's another ball of wax and just plain wrong.

I think the kiting community has moved a little bit away from the close-nit group that it was just a few years ago. There is always danger of moving more towards the surfing norm of "oh crap there are more people here" rather than the general good vibe that is usually extended to fellow kiters.

That good vibe can be maintained if everybody uses common sense and looks out for the other guy. It's important in kiting rather than surfing, since there are more consequences for others when things go wrong. But I note a tendency for folks not to be as mindful as they might be....just little thing like kite-stacking at Sherman, for example. You have to be a moron not to be able to figure out that leaving your kite in the middle of a landing zone is inconvenient or maybe even a little bit dangerous.

And if somebody at a spot gets mad at you, don't just attribute it to localism. Kiters should be proactive in identifying behavior that might be out of line and....politely but forcefully....doing something about it. Part of the reason that there's not as much negative vibe in wavesailing compared to surfing is that it's easier in kiting to identify who's got priority on a wave way in advance of the wave starting to break, and the crowd spreads out more. If somebody gets mad at you at a wavesailing spot, make sure you're not doing something that's unsafe....examine your own behavior and in any case tune up your situational awareness.

Localism is wrong. I've done my part during my youth to try to discourage it. The Bay Boys at Lunada have it coming to them, since over the years the ensuing crops of Bay Boys have devolved into ever diminishing life forms that now encompasses mostly beer swilling trolls. We can and should be on guard in the kiting community to protect the good vibe we have through positive engagement and thoughtfulness to others. Which, in the end, is really not that hard to do.

Unless you're a sociopath. Then you might think about moving to Lunada Bay so you can participate in the lawsuit.

[John Doe]

Here's the problem...

Homes for sale in that neighborhood are priced between $1.5 & $4 million, which means probably none of the "bay boys" actually had to work to purchase a house, excuse me their parents house. I'd put money that none of them purchased the house that they claim gives them "local" status. I'd put a lot of money on that!!!

Which means that they're a bunch of spoiled rich kids who get what they want cuz they have money, or they have their parents money. I know a few brothers that grew up very close to Lunada Bay & their family is stikin rich: houses at the Ranch, Hawaii, Santa Monica, etc., very rich.

Surfing is the only sport where being born somewhere & never leaving gets rewarded very highly.

[friggin old guy]

I don't know how it is today, but in my day the most "active" guys were the ones that were still at home living with mom and dad. They usually moved out when they got to college age, since as is common in many affluent communities with good schools, a very high percentage of kids did attend university, and most of those didn't stay in the area.

If they did stay, they were usually renting a place outside of Palos Verdes proper. Which makes the whole thing of being a "real PV local" that much more egregious.

Over the years, it seems that the age of the locals has gone up. Whether that's a function of older kids more commonly living with mom and dad or "outside" renters hanging out at the Bay swilling beer because they don't have anything better to do....don't know. But I did hear that one of the crops of Bay Boys was completely up in arms a few years ago because their own kids were getting unmercifully hassled by the current crop of jerks. I laughed and laughed. How can you be so small minded?

But I would like to disabuse you of the notion that having the good fortune of growing up in an affluent community makes one a congenital asshole. Most of the kids (surfers too) I grew up with are perfectly nice people. I admit I may be biased.

I live in Lafayette now, and I laugh when I see high school "gangstas" driving around in black Escalades that mom and dad bought them. They try to act all badass but it's really pretty funny. The same kids would undoubtedly be Bay Boys if they lived in PV. As a general rule, they only picked on people weaker than them, only in groups, never one on one. They were a bunch of pussies. You find them anywhere. People just need to stand up, confront them and do the right thing. Unfortunately that can devolve into violence, since small minded folks like that can't understand anything but their own interest, which sometimes takes the form of a punch in the nose.

Too bad surfing gets a lawsuit, but the Bay Boys deserve it even more than a good whooping.

[Cosmicocean]

"As a general rule, they only picked on people weaker than them, only in groups, never one on one. They were a bunch of pussies. You find them anywhere. People just need to stand up, confront them and do the right thing. Unfortunately that can devolve into violence, since small minded folks like that can't understand anything but their own interest, which sometimes takes the form of a punch in the nose."

+1

its interesting that, not always, but seen it a lot, that the most ripping and expert a surfer is the more disfunctional they seem to be on land.
wonder if its because of the endless attention and living according to the elements takes
so much energy that there's not much left for anything else.

its as if surfing expertise is inversely proportional to life's know how sometimes, go figure.

and bdw, surf is my absolute favorite sport, nothing compares to the magic and drama
in epic barreling waves!
kiting in waves comes next..(:^}>

[John Doe]

But I would like to disabuse you of the notion that having the good fortune of growing up in an affluent community makes one a congenital asshole. Most of the kids (surfers too) I grew up with are perfectly nice people. I admit I may be biased.

Typical richie rich assuming that someone whose critical of richie rich kids couldn't have possibly grown up in a wealthy community. Talking down to pooooor me for having growing up on the wrong side of the tracks. Of course you assume that I didn't grow up in a community like that & you're enilightening me to how rich-kid-pricks are really good people?

I grew up in a community just like that. Daddyo was a 30 year plastic surgeon, obsessed with Warren Buffet, account at the country club, millions of dollars, blah blah blah blah. How do you think I ever had any cred with some Bay Boys??? I would put money that 99.9% of those kids that still live at home in a community like that, after turning 18, are rich little spoiled pricks.

Put a rifle in their hand, & send them into Fallujah, they're the first one's crying mommie. Please Friggen Rich Guy, enlighten me again from your lofty perch?

[friggin old guy]

Well for one thing I think you've got some baggage of your own. Sorry you feel im being condescending in any way, but I think you shouldn't slap a lot of negative shit on somebody if you don't know them regardless of where they're from.

Jeez. Lighten up.

[tgautier]

I will build a great seawall — and nobody builds seawalls better than me, believe me —and I'll build them very inexpensively.

I will build a great, great seawall on the southern point of the break, and I will make San Francisco pay for that wall. Mark my words.

But will it be Yuge?

[Red_Element_Andy]

I will build a great seawall — and nobody builds seawalls better than me, believe me —and I'll build them very inexpensively.

I will build a great, great seawall on the southern point of the break, and I will make San Francisco pay for that wall. Mark my words.

But will it be Yuge?

You're gonna love it.

[Aloha]

Let's face it surf culture doesn't exactly embrace acting intelligent even if you are